wait, no “tomoyo meido” storyline?
Categories: anime, fanservice, moe
Tagged: clannad:tomoyo, moe:meido
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160 Responses to “wait, no “tomoyo meido” storyline?”
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Categories: anime, fanservice, moe
Tagged: clannad:tomoyo, moe:meido
160 Comments »
Huh? I thought the wedding ring only came up in Tomoyo after AFTER Tomoya gets hospitalized… Of course, this is all after all the majorly lasvicious scenes occured. And it was a plain ring too.
(Yeah, Tomoya being a garbage collector in parallel run-run ‘Tomoyo After’ meant that the communal budget would be very minimal. At least in After Story, while still being blue-collar, being an electrician technically paid more.)
Not to derail things though Jason, any thoughts on the ultimatum placed on Gonzo by the Tokyo Stock Exchange, the annoucement of an anime adaptation of Umineko no Naku Koro Ni/When the Seagulls Cry (or simply When they Cry 2), or the fact that some Haruhi fans are seriously mixing up Ponytail Haruhi (from Disappearance) with Kyon?
(evidence to the last: http://sos-dan.org/img/src/1215371041615.jpg … Which is based on this one from the Newtype issue: http://sos-dan.org/img/src/1214882907548.jpg)
Suddenly I’m really looking forward to the Clannad OVA
Wish fulfillment, pfft.
Soo, why did we get the Nagisa ending again … ?
Uh, because she’s the main girl? Not readily obvious in the game of course, as each ‘path’ occurs in a parallel ‘universe’ (a fact hammered home in the game’s World of Illusion segments), I’d think that KyoAni’s adaptation makes the reasons fairly obvious.
But that’s probably just me, as a non-fujoshi, non-moe enthusiast looking into the series.
One more minor derailment to add (to the other small ones in my previous posting)… What does Jason think about the fact that the next KEY game after Little Busters (tentatively titled REWRITE) is going to be scripted by the guy who wrote the original Higurashi (and current Umineko) games? Given KyoAni’s partnership/symbiosis with KEY, uh…
Well….I can’t complain about the lack of miedo today.
And yea, Key-KyoAni REWRITE. I wonder. I wonder.
I find the partnership of KEY and Ryukishi intriguing, if only for the fact that we’ll get something different from Jun Maeda’s writing for a change. No question, I absolutely loved CLANNAD and AIR (Little Busters less so), but his ‘crying game’ style gets tiring after a while.
Also, HRNGG… One of the pitfalls of working in an American brokerage firm is listening to people whine about how their stocks have been tanking for the past few weeks (BEAR MARKET!!). Well, CRY ME A RIVER, CHILD OF ANGST! The Philippine stock market ain’t doing too well either, so spare me.
So yeah, I needed to vent. Someday’s Dreamers: Summer’s Sky? Hidamari Sketch X365? YES PLEASE. Moe? Unless it’s something in the vein of Potemayo, pass.
Ugh, Haess was right, I am broken, but not in the way he defined it. Good thing I don’t have a chainsword right now…
Incidentally, Tomoyo in that pic… Half a meido is more like it, but I think that’s Jason’s point.
*drools*
Grr, WordPress ate my post, so I will now include less links of goodness.
Anyways, Rewrite is going to written by four authors, Key’s in house scenario writer who’s worked since Kanon, Higurashi’s Ryuukishi, a new guy, and The famous (In the eroge world) Tanaka Romeo who’s biggest work available in english would be Yume Miru Kusuri, translated by Peach Princess.
With all these hands gathered, as well as the tagline on the main page for Rewrite, I expect it to both be extremely good as well as a fairly dark game. At the very least, I imagine it will be sad.
I have the sinking feeling that, within one week, we’ll see a post titled, “wait, no ‘angry ticks fire out of my nipples/Kogarashi’s mask/C.C.’s Pizza Hut Butt/[insert meme here]’ storyline?”
Many thanks for the gratuitous Tomoyo pic, though. ^_^
Kouryuu: Well, isn’t it a point in Jun Maeda’s writing to make the reader CRY BUCKETS OF TEARS ™? :) So, yeah, a rather darker game in REWRITE would be a welcome change. I have to say though, which part of the story with Ryukishi handle?
KyoAni’s SURE to have dibs on this one, which will make countless watchers cry out in horror as FMP and Haruhi get pushed back even further in their schedule… >_>
Key’s main feature is their cry-wank style. Jun Maeda… come back!!!
Well, next week Tomoyo’s OVA is out… we’ll see what KyoAni has done.
>> Ugh, Haess was right, I am broken, but not in the way he defined it. Good thing I don’t have a chainsword right now…
Myssa, why does your commenting pattern for this post remind me of Haess and a typical Mako-cakes post? But I think you are broken like anyone else here. Meido Tomoyo just tossed it over the line. Have we found your new threshold? Is Tomoyo both womanly and manly enough for you? Or is it still Kyonko?
(Kyoto’s project, after more Clannad, should be Mirai Nikki. That’s the correct choice.)
>> Soo, why did we get the Nagisa ending again … ?
Because anytime you can pick Sam Bowie over MJ, you gotta do it. I think.
For the record, I never said I hated Nagisa. I just don’t think she should be the end girl for Clannad. For Wind, Final Approach, H2O, sure, she’d make a wonderful end girl. Just not for Clannad. I’ve written this many times, and I have no clue why you guys think I hate Nagisa. Thinking that she does not deserve the #1 overall pick is very different from “hating” something.
>> Suddenly I’m really looking forward to the Clannad OVA
I’m looking forward to it as well, but I think I want to play Tomoyo After more.
I’m with you Jason, I wna’t to play tomoyo after as well. Sadly, that will have to wait…
Nagisa is just a huge wet blanket. Anytime spent on her could be better spent on Tomoyo, Kyou, or Kotomi.
I think Kyoto would be a good fit for the Toradora anime, not that that’ll happen. Its not as typical a loli-tsundere rom-com as it initially seems.
Just as long as its not J.C. Staff.
I would also like to see them doing something that’s a little weird, a little out of left field.
People are going to watch what they animate, they have that kind of reputation. Why not use those powers for good?
Myssa- you are very broken… and a Tomoyo meido (well, half-meido – there wasn’t enough in the budget for the full thing) did it. Congratulations on posting like me on a Minami-ke post.
Jason- planetarian would make an interesting OVA, but I doubt that they’d do it – the only relationship there was well before the game began, and it only has one cute girl, so that’s out.
And isn’t Tomoyo After basically Key telling Tomoya that he is the Biggest Loser they’ve ever written?
Wait, is that a bad thing? :-?
Scenario, IIRC.
“the fact that some Haruhi fans are seriously mixing up Ponytail Haruhi (from Disappearance) with Kyon?”
Who’s confusing. We are intentionally changing that Haruhi into Kyon-chan. It is the Ponytailed Haruhi from behind (in a cameo from another series even) getting confused with Kyon-chan that is the debate for Saimoe.
Haesslich: Planetarian, true, only encompasses one game, but it can easily fit into a two or three-part OVA, as there are two more stories that pick up after the man leaves the theatre (and is subsequently chased AGAIN by the machines): the old man’s story (if I’m remembering it right) and that of the two sisters.
Wow…
Danbooru has 912 images for ‘kyonko’
‘asahina mikuru’=44
‘nagato yuki’=75
‘school uniform’=431
Wow.
uh nvm, i was looking at the wrong thing.
mikuru has like 1800.
PS: Jason, this was the post you were thinking of? Haruka-neesama plus Hayami getting Kana with the scary eyes. Oh, and the Okawari preview.
Mmmm.
Myssa: Are you talking about the novel and the drama CD? Yes, those stories might get in… but then the storyline would be a tad more disjointed, and probably wouldn’t catch KyoAni’s interest, since it’s more sob than harem… and harem shows sell better. There’s the Junker storyline, the one of the kid who used to visit the planetarium, there’s the girls.. and then there’s that one with that employee, who follows Reverie when she goes off to do something, then the very ending one just before all hell breaks loose.
Haesslich: More like a hard day at work. ;) No worries about being broken totally, yet. It’ll take a Wallstreet crash on the level of the one that preceded the Great Depression to break me (since I’d probably be out of work).
Ah Kyon, turn Mars into a Venus and people start scatching their heads… Did I ever mention the fact that, as of yesterday, my Seitenkan folder’s archive of images has fully overtaken everything else in my SOS-Dan folder? Even YUKI — which is funny, since the Yuki thread in Sos-dan.org has been cranking out images since the series started, and yet only recently broke the 13th page. The Genderswap thread hit its 12th page, but it’s been going only since November or so last year. ^^;
Now that is scary stuff.
From a business standpoint, yeah, harems will sell better, as they do pander to the fantasies of non-adjusted socially-inept moe-starved otakus, but I wouldn’t count out Planetarian just yet. The studio might need another hit though to give them leeway in even producing it — must please the corporate sponsors first (Kadokawa I’m looking at you).
Still, the chance of Little Busters (and now REWRITE) being produced first is more likely. Which is a little sad… Oh well, can’t bite the hand that feeds you (too much)…
Myssa: There’s SO many things I could say… but I won’t. About work, and about the genderswap. ;)
But, going onto a safe topic… yes, the harems sell much better, and the stories in Planetarian as an OVA would be disjointed, and I can’t think of any series or OVA’s in recent memory which pulled that off successfully (same setting, four different stories, one character touching on all of them). It’d be like Yokohama Kaidaishi Kikou… which means it’d probably be panned as ‘too derivative’.
Basically, I don’t see Kadokawa or Kodansha, or anyone else allowing KyoAni any real leeway there – they’re more likely to put out FMP or more Haruhi and Lucky Star than anything else. If it’s Key, then it’s Rewrite or Little Busters.
Or Toei will put our a Planetarium movie and force the issue.
Ithekro: God forbid.
Haesslich: It gives us fans something to kill time with, and it’s an amusing diversion for a change. To Haruhiism, ’tis harmless, and as many people have pointed out before, genderswapping has been a staple of anime fandom since God-knows how long; It just took a while to catch on in Haruhi (probably because Haruhi, Mikuru, and Yuki push all the right otaku buttons).
The wierdness can only escalate though, with the introduction of Sasaki, Fujiwara, Kyoko, and Kuyo. Thank goodness that people haven’t decided on genderchanging THEM. Yet. One can only pray (that they don’t succeed — I’m personally horrified at seeing a male Kuyo).
Myssa: It also broke you, in a big way. It’s just the half-naked Tomoyo which got you into ranting mode, versus genderswapped Kyon. And now look at what’s happening to Jason – he’s jumping straight into BL, with a bit of prompting from Geass R2…
Some of use like the clarity of genderbending to traps. No questioning the gender of the character in question. No “Oh Geass NO!” moments there.
That said, their is a lack of Minami around. Haruka-nee-sama needs a lot more love.
Side note: Kana and Touma have pulled off respectible numbers for Saimoe already. I was surprised. Chiaki and Haruku should do even better, though I think people like “I AM BOSS”.)
(ﾉﾟ-ﾟ)ﾉ☆ DOZO!
Not exactly preaching to the crowd, but I do say I’m less confused about genderswapping than the way of the Trap. Regardless of what Haess meant in a previous argument about having to do a mental double-take, when the transition is goes on well enough with just the minimum required logical backflips, I don’t dwell on it. And face it, Kyon transitions well into a flat-chested girl with a ponytail, as his personality more or less survives intact (though I see some of the OH THE SHOUJO doujin that have come out so far makes me wonder a bit). It doesn’t work as well as, oh, with Setsuna F. Seiei for example.
Also, speaking as someone who actually works on the same floor as an ACTUAL trap, I tell you, it’s REALLY disturbing. Said trap possessing a Series 7 license is even MORE disturbing.
Series 7 license? And I’ve worked with trannies before – no biggie, although there are some who look more feminine than others. And I do think that the damage that genderbending does can be… traumatic. Like, ‘breaks Jason into collecting BL’ type of trauma. ;)
Kyon’s very sarcastic. There’s characters who are male and who are female who’ve had similar personalities, so that’s nothing new. It’s just the heretical crossing of EVERYTHING which makes for problems…. like Jason-going-around-the-bend.
There’s a more important question to be asked, anyways: if Touma and Mako-chan kiss, does it count as yuri or straight on Touma’s side, or yaoi/straight on Mako-chan’s?
Haesslich: It’s a brokerage license. In fact, it’s the bare minimum someone in the business of stock trading has to have in order to buy/seel/discuss/officially talk about anything even remotely connected to stocks. ;)
As for the Mako-chan/Touma question, unless they go under the knife somehow, I’d say it’s neither; it’ll be a very heterosexual (but WIERD) relationship.
Yeah, you do not have to stress the fact that I work for a BROKE-rage firm. I try not to think about the illogical connotations of the semantics of my line of work.
To continue with the Mako-chan/Touma question… At most, without any physical modification of some sort, it comes something that, in comrade Crusader’s terminology, “ersatz yuri” or pseudo-yuri, as we’re all aware of the fact that Makoto is a boy (who just likes dressing up as a girl) and Touma is a girl (who speaks and dresses casually as a boy). Now, unless Makoto somehow loses all of the tubing associated to the male gender, then we can truthfully say that the situation would just SCREAM yuri. Though it makes one wonder who would be the soke and uke in that…
*coughs*
>> And isn’t Tomoyo After basically Key telling Tomoya that he is the Biggest Loser they’ve ever written?
Uh, no. Sunohara.
>> And now look at what’s happening to Jason – he’s jumping straight into BL, with a bit of prompting from Geass R2…
It’s not my fault that the anime I’m reviewing has more homoerotic overtones than the Ace and Gary DVD collection.
>> Or Toei will put our a Planetarium movie and force the issue.
They can have Planetarium. I’ve been reading up on Rewrite, and it seems intriguing. Has Key-VA become the Blizzard of visual novels? Or does Type Moon figure in there as well?
>> Now, unless Makoto somehow loses all of the tubing associated to the male gender, then we can truthfully say that the situation would just SCREAM yuri.
How did a post about meido Tomoyo turn into this… ? I feel like Dr. Oppenheimer: what have I done?!?
Ah. And well… if Mako-chan’s kissing Touma because she’s dressed boyishly, does that make him gay? Or just hetero with more twists than Jason after a Twister game?
And Mako-chan’s the uke. Definitely the uke. I’m sorry, but just look at how Kana and Chiaki effortlessly dominate him into all those weird situations (and outfits). Touma’s the one who’d wear the pants in that relationship, pun intended.
That’s easy – you created this blog, then helped break readers… and you’re SURPRISED when a topic gets derailed when Myssa Rei and I are holding court in the middle of it? You really ought to get us Guest Blogger icons or something.
Or get her a Clannad-style school uniform. Or something. I’ll just steal Hosaka’s jacket and GOD belt.
Eh… Tomoya chose Nagisa, gets depressed, gets a second chance.. and well… he loses anyways. Sunohara can’t have done worse than this, could he?
Look at the Kara no Kyoukai anime. I dare you to – it has a Shiki who’s sexy, and was never originally male, and much blood. I’d put Type-MOON up there as well, even if they’ve only a few things to their name. Key is like the Sunrise of VN’s (lots of product, lots of GOOD product, a few which are passable), while Type-MOON is like the KyoAni (not a lot of product out there, but great quality on all of it and they have a cult following).
And yes.. it IS your fault – you picked the shows, even knowing they were yaoi-fests last time (Code Geass). You made your bed of BL material – now lie in it. ;)
>> Sunohara can’t have done worse than this, could he?
Nah, there’s a happy end with Tomoya. And, unlike, Sunohara, at least girls dig him. Sunohara’s got nobody except the rugby team.
>> And yes.. it IS your fault – you picked the shows, even knowing they were yaoi-fests last time (Code Geass).
Nah, what else was I going to blog last season? Druaga disappointed and Kamen no Maid Guy can’t buy a sub. Macross Frontier ended up being okay, but out of all the shows, Code Geass still was the most entertaining.
To make it worse, I’m not liking any shows that I’ve seen this season. If Birdy is the best this season has to offer, you’re getting a steady diet of Code Geass posts. I’m hoping Detroit Metal City is good.
You may as well just blog Antique Bakery and be done with it, Jason. At least there’s only ONE gay character there, versus the BL love-fest Geass is apparently turning into.
May I also suggest Hidamari Sketch 365 for the weirdness? It’s not Sayonara Zetsubou Sensei, but it’s fun. Certainly better than half the stuff out there at the moment. Or you could just find some shojo/kosei show and blog that, to unbreak Myssa and Myself, only to break us in completely NEW ways.
Heh, actually I’d think that Tomoya was pretty much a big loser, at least with regards to the professions he chose after graduating high school. In CLANNAD, he becomes an electrician, which as far as I know doesn’t really pay well unless you’re part of an established company; in Tomoyo After, it’s a garbage collector (!!). Sunohara, by comparison, is much MUCH more well-off, and while it’s pretty much alluded to that he becomes a salaryman when he goes back to Tokyo, at least he’s doing well for himself.
Heck, even Yuuichi from KANON had more going for him than Tomoya.
I’d advise Jason to just continue with the shows he’s watching right now. As for myself, I added Hidamari Sketch X365, Slayers Revolution, and Someday’s Dreamers to Macross Frontier, Code Geass R2, Kyouran Kazoku Nikki, and Allison to Lillia to my schedule.
… What? My viewing tastes are pretty normal. Don’t give me that look.
Electricians aren’t paid badly at all. Hiring one to do some work is usually pretty expensive in CA. Payscale is a national average, and it’s still higher than the US median household income:
http://www.payscale.com/resear.....man/Salary
It’s about the same range as a paralegal or brokerage clerk. Though sanitation worker seems a bit off though.
Tomoya has a median income job… a loving significant other (x2)… that’s not bad. Life isn’t just about making $$$. Though Tomoya doesn’t have a wooden starfish Gundam.
>> Hidamari Sketch x365
Lucky Star minus Tsukasa and a cell phone… not sure if I want to go down this road again.
Well Yuuichi picks Ayu which is much worse compared to Nagisa or Tomoyo. I don’t think we really know what he does after high school, but his grades don’t suck like Tomoya’s so he might get into college or atleast he won’t be a blue collar worker.
What DOES Sunohara do anyway? I know he ends up with some company but the details aren’t there lol. Anyway I don’t think Tomoya’s that bad off, if you consider the True end he’s a lot happier than Sunohara and a lot better off then if he married Tomoyo.
A good job is one thing but happiness =/= money.
Oh yeah while it sucks that there’s no Tomoyo meido storyline, I think in the PS2 version of Tomoyo After you can get her to wear a meido outfit XD. Also in the After Story there really is a Nagisa meido sub-plot of sorts O.o;
>> I think in the PS2 version of Tomoyo After you can get her to wear a meido outfit
Why was I not informed about this before!?
Well, Nagisa goes off and starts working full-time as a waitress in a cafe (mirroring Maaka in Karin, if one goes by the last volume of the manga) — in fact, Tomoya and her dad often drop by to tease her about it (yeah, no Angel Mort outfit, but I thought it was pretty cute). As for Tomoyo After, uh, not really, but we get to see Tomoyo in the bear costume again.
I’d have to say that happiness does mitigate the sucky choice of after-graduation profession, but c’mon…
I thought the big kicker which starts Tomoyo After was Nagisa dies and Tomoya goes alcoholic, like his dad… and ends with him dying ANYWAYS, despite picking Tomoyo. Seriously, nothing says butt-monkey like that, not even picking Ayu.
Yup. Spoiler tag FAILED.
yep failure….but at least we have miedo.
No, man, just you fail. :)
It’s spoiler not spoilers to use the tag.
I feel like inserting a random comment into your 3-way discussion…
The series Dissent picked would be entertaining to be sure (Mysterious Girlfriend X and Sundome)… if a bit too ecchi for any time but early early morning JST, but I think Toradora should definitely be put back a LONG LONG time, because it’s definitely another Rie tsundere role, and has so many ZnT overtones that it practically screams copyright infringement. I can’t even read the translations at baka-tsuki without thinking of Saito/Louise every time the two main characters have an exchange.
… not in Tomoyo After. Nor in Clannad. I feel like Hecate from the “Konoe Strikes Back” short now.
Jason: Ouch, low blow, as I work for a brokerage firm myself. :P
I earn comparitively well though, if one considers the fact that minimum wage here in the Philippines is around 125 Php per day; I earn around 865 Php per day, which more or less equals around 9,450 Php (without taxes) every 15th and 30th (a total of around 18,900 a month). Admittedly it’s not much when compared to US standards, but for the common Filipino, one can only earn that much by either leaving to work abroad, being a professional like a doctor or engineer, or by having lots and lots of sidelines/investments. ;)
It’s enough to live comfortably in the upper middle-class strata, with enough to spare for whatever stuff is left over after savings and bills are paid. Admittedly I’m still single, but I’m in no rush yet.
testing 123
Haesslich: Nope, Tomoyo After happens parallel with After Story, since it picks up a year or so AFTER Tomoya graduates from high school. After Story has a time skip of around 3-5 years (Ushio’s age), and we see some of the supporting (Kyou and Ryou specificially, since Kyou is Ushio’s teacher) cast grown up and working themselves.
Nnnnng, spoiler tag failure!
still, with the way THAT game went, it’s like he’s the worst of Key’s harem-masters in terms of fate. Most of them actually GET a happily ever after. This? Well, at least it’s not Planetarian.
Myssa: Single, but horribly, terribly broken. ;) And isn’t mentioning single status on the Internet (especially in a blog like this) like setting up a ‘stalk_OK’ flag for otaku?
hedric: What is the unladen wing speed of an African sparrow?
Is it male or female? :P
Kidding aside, I have to thank the fact that anime geekery and stalking don’t generally go hand-in-hand in the Philippines, so I’m safe (plus I’m incognito at cons). THAT only defines spoiled children of government officials.
>> And isn’t mentioning single status on the Internet (especially in a blog like this) like setting up a ’stalk_OK’ flag for otaku?
Well, I’m guessing Myssa thinks that by now, most readers would have either been derailed by Tomoyo or be scared off by the 30 Mako-cakes-related comments that proceeded this.
>> it’s not much when compared to US standards
How much does an average 3 bedroom house cost in the Philippines? For Silicon Valley, it’s about US$700,000. Cost of living is a lot higher.
Jason: It really depends, but your average house and lot (the stuff you don’t find in the city) cost really low by American standards. Some of our US bosses who visit here joke about being able to buy a house and lot (lot size 176 square meters, modest really) for 1.3 million Php… Which is around 28,000 USD.
Of course, the cost of living in Metro Manila is much higher… To give you an idea, the 2-floor, 2-bedroom apartment my family lived in for most of my life (which my mom and dad bought the deed to, but only the part we lived in — our landlords were greedy grubbers I tell you) cost a grand total of 1.5 mil Php or so, and they’d been saving for several years at that point. My sister and I am kind of outgrowing the place, but the plus side of it all is the fact that it’s close enough to the International Airport that we’ve become sort of the port of call for all our relatives arriving from abroad/leaving for work abroad.
I like how, 60 comments and almost 24 hours later, this post has been derailed outright. Cheap ASEAN real-estate FTW!
Well, not ALL the perverts who come here are derailed by Tomoyo, as evidenced by everyone who voted for lolis in the polls for the past year… of which there were 28% of them. :P And she’s already mentioned other things which are kinda fetish-points for otaku. Seriously, some of those fuckers are SCARY… in a pathetic way, granted, but I’d still suggest arming oneself.
Myssa: I think I recall you from the Megatokyo forums as well, IIRC. Among others, including EFML and the old Evafics.org…
Yup, ancient, we are.
This is Myssa Rei and myself. We can derail Jason any day of the week. Maybe it’s time he changed the blog name…
My only goal really is to make enough money so I can pull a Yoshitaka with a giant mansion in Atherton (or Maui). But it doesn’t look likely since with this crappy economy, my stock options aren’t doing very well.
>> Seriously, some of those fuckers are SCARY…
Well, you scared me when you flooded my inbox with Mako-cakes.
>> We can derail Jason any day of the week
Whatever. I don’t get derailed easily. My posts, on the other hand…
And Tomoyo? Pft, give me Hosaka anytime.
According to the Sent Items folder, I derailed with more Haruka than Mako-cakes. Whatever floats your boat, though.
… says the guy who was derailed from Black Lagoon Symmetrical Meido Docking by a Shanatan melonpan pic.
DONE. Will these do?
http://img184.imageshack.us/im.....mihux1.jpg
http://img122.imageshack.us/im.....kapfe1.png
http://kurogane.animeblogger.n.....hosaka.jpg
douzo
>> … says the guy who was derailed from Black Lagoon Symmetrical Meido Docking by a Shanatan melonpan pic.
What are you talking about? Shana-tan has no melonpan. You’ve gone off the deep end.
Never trust a guy who digs up Hosaka images in 5 minutes.
This:
http://derailedbydarry.com/ima....._13_HD.jpg
See request stemming from comment here in the Shana-tan: Konoe Strikes Back thread.
The derailing of that post began after I mentioned the Symmetrical Docking, then you asked for Shanatan wallpapers.
And I keep an extensive Minami-ke folder. Including all those Haruka shots I sent from the pool episode.
PS: It’s amazing how many Haruka shots I have, versus Kana or Chiaki shots. But… she is indeed amazing.
Myssa: Let me know if you need more derailing.
Ha ha! Good thing my work IP blocks Imageshack links. Haess, you are one scary, scary person…
And, oh, Shana does uguu~
http://myssa.teri-chan.net/Images/Shana03.jpg
Oh yeah. Who’s you’re loli now?
http://myssa.teri-chan.net/Images/Shana04.jpg
And bandages. De-arimasu.
http://myssa.teri-chan.net/Images/Shana09.jpg
Just to bring things back to all things meido: Wilhemina. De arimasu.
http://myssa.teri-chan.net/Images/Shana24.jpg
http://myssa.teri-chan.net/Images/Shana12.jpg
Pffft, that’s just melon-flavored bread. I’m talking melonpan.
(And how is that considered a derailment? The post was about Shana-tan anyway.)
I guess it’s time again…
Like both of you had pointed out, despite what kind of job you do, the important thing is that you can be happy with it. For example, I’m fine with my low-government position for the moment. I’d a good salary, maybe it doesn’t allow me to have everything I need or want at the moment, but is enough to live relativity fine over here. The only thing I regretted is all the money I spent last year in useless things, otherwise, the trip to this year’s Anime Expo in LA couldn’t have been a reality.
Now, following the original topic (lost about 60 posts ago); I agree with the opinion that Tomoya’s the weakest male lead in Key’s works. Despite the “happy end†he had with Nagisa, everything else seemed too weak (or so I read here and there). In the anime, he picked up Nagisa because she was the one he spent time the most; he knew Kyou and Ryou from a long time, were childhood friends with Kotomi-chan and knew how to handle Tomoyo. I don’t know if KyoAni made the right choice with Nagisa, but this time I couldn’t agreed with them (I did it with Ayu for various reasons).
By the way, the moment you step over here, it means you’re broken from the beginning…
What about Slayers? XD To me that’s the best series of the season so far. I also still have hopes for Blade of the Immortal. Apart from that, yep, Birdy is the best. And Otakus might like Haruka’s secret.
And are you still watching Kaiba? It has turned away from the episodic stories, and imho it keeps getting better with each episode.
Oh, and was Roberta included in the Maid Pantheon?
I almost forgot…
Today on my way home, I was listening to a cell phone conversation on the bus and couldn’t hold some giggles, like everyone else on the bus, when the guy started to talk about revenge and humiliate those “bitches†that betrayed “himâ€. Everyone was laughing so shamelessly and yet he didn’t minded at all; so I told myself “Well, at least I’m not the only one broken hereâ€.
Now that I think about it, when did I break again? Never mind, the only think I certainly know is that I was already broken before meeting you guys.
Jaaaaaaaaaaason… Again, to steer things to something even remotely connected to Meido, do watch the following vid:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fM4NYOIE9Vs
Dancing meido? Getto!
Thanks Myssa Rei, you just gave me one more reason to see this series. Damn it, I need the RAW right now….
Serious derailment is serious. Fortunately it is a broken derailment, so situation normal.
Needs more Haruka is Amazing.
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@Myssa Rei & Jason:
Please don’t get the wrong impression, I do not hate Nagisa or anything. I also understand, she is the main girl, the one with the best story in the game and everything …
It’s just as someone who never played the game and only saw the anime version, she is the one at least interesting for me (jeah, even lower than Fuko – the last episode of her arc was awesome). Maybe I would change my mind, if I would play the actual game, but then again we are talking about the anime here, not the much referred game.
But then it was intended as an rhetorical question anyway oO
Versus: In nomen of Deus Empress , subsisto vestri inrideo! Ordo Nagisa summitto quam Fuuko? Vos es aut caecus vel simplex operor non intellectum. Nagisa’s simplicity est suus rectum!
Is est totus in bonus humor , mens vos , tamen vindico ut Nagisa est vel magis boring quam FUUKO? * infirmo caput capitis *
… I think I had a WH40k siezure.
Maa ii, I can understand why folk might not float the moe modes of other people. *shakes head* Much like how some childhood friends get the short end of the relationship stick, the plain and ‘normal’ girl often gets passed over as well.
I suppose the problem with Clannad TV is that they split it into 2 seasons, they should have just shown it all at once. Because Nagisa really only develops some character in the after story. Also they really concentrated too much on the most boring characters, ie Kotomi and Fuko, who got more than half of the season for them. while Kyou, Ryou and Tomoyo only got a few episodes all together – eventhough they’re way more interesting ^^
And it was quite annoying how they made drama out of things that really aren’t a big deal -_- the Clannad movie handles this a lot better. But that one deals with Nagisa only and also includes the after story.
I have to agree that Nagisa is less boring than Fuko, but Fuko is just so much more annoying XD
ugh I meant Fuko is less boring than Nagisa ^^;;
>>In the anime, he picked up Nagisa because she was the one he spent time the most;
No, he picked her because he loved her… unlike in the game, he had no feelings for any of the other girls except for maybe Kotomi.
And yeah, his job in AS isn’t so bad. His job in TA, however, is utter suck.
>>Thank goodness that people haven’t decided on genderchanging THEM. Yet.
Yes, yes we have. Kuyoh looks like School Rumble’s Karasuma with slightly longer hair, by the way.
Spam protection ate my post last night, pre-derail, when this was much more timely:
I’m not waiting until after. I hate sloppy seconds. Although, if I stare at that pic much longer, she could probably make me change my mind….
*zooms out from computer, behind Cyclops, as he read this post*
AHHH HAAAA! SERVICES YOU RIGHT!
*zooms back into the computer*
Okay, im done now. Maybe I am still angry for all those lost posts…
Jason – considering that you’d said you wanted a post about Black Lagoon, I’d call that derailed.
Myssa- that’s why I went to bed after that last post – to avoid a seizure like yours. Did you wave a little chainsword or censer of incense around as well? ;)
>> Syaoran Li: I don’t know if KyoAni made the right choice with Nagisa, but this time I couldn’t agreed with them (I did it with Ayu for various reasons).
…I fail to see how Ayu wasn’t second from worst choice. Nagisa’s a little vanilla but she’s an incomparable improvement on Ayu.
>> Minikui: Also they really concentrated too much on the most boring characters, ie Kotomi and Fuko
Kotomi was my favourite for Tomoya! But like a certain other first arc girl Fuko’s definitely went on too long.
one hundredth post!
@Myssa Rei:
Kukuku, sorry about that didn’t want to cause problems for your health. Honestly.
The god empress ? I am not too familiar with neither the W40k universe and the language you just spoke, but wasn’t it the God Emperor waiting in his prison like throne on Earth, feeding on a thousand young souls a day to stay alive? (Okay I lied, I love the W40k universe :p)
On the topic, Nagisa doesn’t cut it for me, because of her submissive personality. This “I am sorry”, “I am at fault”, bla bla thingy. It’s getting even worse than the spineless harem male leads or the bleeding noses (to draw some comparison with other harem animes). Maybe this is the ideal Japanese woman, but for me a woman must have her own head without the “I am sorry, that I am alive”-attitude to be interesting (No moé modes included here, just the girl – like I would see her in life).
As for the moè modes, Tomoyo looks damn delicious here.
I guess Fuko beats Nagisa, was more like setting a bomb. No actual harm was intended and yes, she is annoying, way more than Nagisa ;), but that makes her at least a bit interesting (she is also a bit crazy – usually not the worst sign).
I guess in the end, taste is something that can’t really be argued … Did I mention already Tomoyo looks damn delicious here ?
@Syaoran Li
Now, following the original topic (lost about 60 posts ago); I agree with the opinion that Tomoya’s the weakest male lead in Key’s works. Despite the “happy end†he had with Nagisa, everything else seemed too weak (or so I read here and there). In the anime, he picked up Nagisa because she was the one he spent time the most; he knew Kyou and Ryou from a long time, were childhood friends with Kotomi-chan and knew how to handle Tomoyo. I don’t know if KyoAni made the right choice with Nagisa, but this time I couldn’t agreed with them (I did it with Ayu for various reasons).
Wait have you played the game? After reading all of the game I think Tomoya has to be one of the most well developed harem male leads ever x.x; His choices make more sense than you might think, and the AS true end is a win-win situation for him.
I agree with the Nagisa pairing because I’m a Nagisa fan, but it’s not like Nagisa randomly gets Tomoya to love him just because she’s the main girl (Like Ayu lol).
Nagisa won partly because she was so different from Tomoya and had a family life that was basically what he desired. She was able to change him and his view on life in general and she showed him another side of the world that he couldn’t imagine himself (Normal family lol……). Besides Tomoya helping her, Nagisa offered Tomoya a lot of emotional support, which Tomoya acknowledges in the game. He even says that he’s the one being saved.
As for why he doesn’t pick the other girls in the anime…
For Ryou he just didn’t have any feelings for her, also they barely knew each other and even in 2nd year they didn’t talk much. To Tomoya she was just another random girl/class rep that happend to be Kyou’s sister.
For Kyou… well it makes more sense in the game then the anime. Even though she knew Tomoya longer she didn’t really understand him as much. Also to quote Tomoyo, “Time and titles do not matter in bonds between people. Tomoya’s too thickheaded to get the hints. Well
by the time the gym storage room happened he was too busy thinking about Nagisa 24/7.
As for Fuko, that’s a no brainer. Even she supported the Nagisa end haha.
Kotomi was just a childhood friend to him.
I don’t have too good of an excuse for Tomoyo, but I guess the he fell in love with Nagisa already argument works here too. Tomoyo barely showed up in the early episodes to create a bond with him. In the game you have to not help out Nagisa to get with Tomoyo, although if you aren’t acquainted with Nagisa you’ll get a bed end O.o;
“Well by the time the gym storage room happened he was too busy thinking about Nagisa 24/7.”
if that were to happen to me, i would just forget about Nagisa…
Wow, the comments has broken into 3 digits, has this ever happened before?
Ooooookay.
100+ comments and more than two thirds are broken. I’m skipping this post until normality returns – hopefully that should be around the time of the next Code Geass episode.
What is this normal you speak of?
I don’t think we go on quite this much if we get derailed by something else, but with no new derailment, the present derailment gets focus fired by the Broken.
>On the topic, Nagisa doesn’t cut it for me, because of her submissive >personality. This “I am sorryâ€, “I am at faultâ€, bla bla thingy. It’s getting >even worse than the spineless harem male leads or the bleeding noses >(to draw some comparison with other harem animes). Maybe this is the >ideal Japanese woman
you could say that. Nagisa is by far not the only character with this kind of personality, and it’s quite annoying or rather … sad? It’s definitely an ideal. But this kind of behavior doesn’t do much for me either … on the other hand I also dislike the “violent girl”, how do you call it … Tsundere? =P Anime needs more “normal” characters, or maybe I’m getting too old for it.
Personally it also annoys me how in about every anime you will always see the mother or the girl doing the cocking and cleaning as if it’s completely normal (apart from series that make fun of the girl being unable to cock). They’re still so macho ;)
[Hecate] Mission Complete. [/Hecate]
>personally it also annoys me how in about every anime you will always >see the mother or the girl doing the cocking and cleaning as if it’s >completely normal (apart from series that make fun of the girl being >unable to cock).
Must…. resist…. commenting on spelling…. Arrrggggghhh !!!!
girl…. unable… to… cock….
Pesty: It’s proof that everyone posting here is broken. Enjoy the brokenness. ;)
Jason has discovered the secret formula for the Blog that Goes Forever: post a provocative picture followed by an ambiguous one-liner promising more to come.
I would say it’s a sad reflection of his readership if not for the pure genius!
@Minikui:
I agree. It’s really sad to see so much stereotypes in animes these days. We are getting old :D
It’s the same as when the completely useless and utter failures of lives, that are male harem leads this days, are either running away/falling unconscious in a pool of blood and/or loud yelling at the poor girl (To LuveRu had this to the extend of me dropping the show after 2 episodes for just that one reason).
I never understood the whole bleeding nose thing anyway? If one does see a naked female, “feels up” breasts and so on, wouldn’t the blood normally rush anywhere but the brain oO ?
In the Context of the game:
Although Nagisa is more or less the first girl Tomoya meets (where everything starts off grey but turns into full color as Nagisa’s monologue continues), the player is in no manner obliged to pursue a relationship with her — indeed, if you want you could ignore her completely and try, oh, Misae, like Jason had done. Such is the way with Visual Novels, as they’re four parts storytelling, six parts wish fulfillment. Since Nagisa is essentially the most ‘normal’ of the girls in the game, it’s easy to pass her up and select the other characters who have more to give on the ‘moe’ table. Which panders to the wish fulfillment of lovelorn male otakus.
Given the fact that I am NOT a male lovelorn otaku looking for their fixing of moe, I found Nagisa’s story more engaging BECAUSE she was normal. Speaking as someone who spent most of my formative years in a gender-segregated catholic school, believe me, some of the traits that some of you find ‘moe’ in the haremettes, they’re annoying in real life. Normal is good.
In the Context of the Anime…
Although ‘Family’ is supposed to be the central theme of the game, it’s message is mostly diluted by the fact that the game has multiple paths available. Indeed, in some paths it’s not only glossed upon but discarded altogether (Kyou’s route, partly with Tomoyo’s route). However, in the anime, no matter how much you dispute it, it’s brought obliquely (and I do mean obliquely since KyoAni is trying to please everyone here) into focus with the contrasting circumstances of Tomoya and Nagisa’s family lives: Tomoya’s sucks, while Nagisa’s, although it’s not always flowers and birdsong, is LEAGUES better than his. Ignore it if you like, but the theme of Family is still there.
I have to add as well the fact that, unlike many harem anime adaptations I’ve seen, the build up of Tomoya and Nagisa’s relationship through the first run of CLANNAD felt entirely natural. None of the tired deus-ex-machina we’ve seen before (not obviously anyway).
Anyway, I have to start on work. More from me in a few hours.
See, I feel the exact opposite about Nagisa.
Her situation doesn’t feel natural, or normal or whatever. Let’s avoid the word ‘normal’. The neediness, or lack of confidence or whatever, that all the girls exhibit makes them all abnormal. I mean that’s the nature of the beast here. Tomoya’s whole role is to be the source of encouragement for whichever path you choose. And really the situations of all the girls are abnormal (two twin girls liking the same guy, childhood friend whose parents died, girl whose parents gave up career to open bread shop).
So really, all the girls are in weird situations. The only way to discern them is personality.
And Nagisa, to me at least, had the worst personality. She was the most spineless with the least reason to be. Sure she was probably the ‘nicest’, and so would probably be the most bland, or normal, or easiest to deal with if you had to go to school with her (i’m assuming that’s what you mean Myssa). But she had no fire. She had heart, but no passion. She was bleh. And bleh is the last thing I want out of girls, animated or otherwise.
If there is fantasy fulfillment going on in these games it has little to do with moe modes, or costumes or whatever. Its the whole idea that there are girls in the real world that are interesting, deep, and passionate. And in this respect, Nagisa fails. She’s the little sister you have to take care of, the china you keep wrapped up in tissue paper. She never seems like a real love interest to me.
Pesty: That was a simple typo … but now I just looked it up in a dictionary, bah – the one that realizes such a typo is the really broken one XD
The theme of family was definitely present during the anime and it was Tomoyo who had the best lines about it.
However Tomoya’s family only makes sense in the after story and the “drama” about Nagisa’s family and their “dark secret” was really exaggerated. The first season really can’t stand on it’s own v.v As said, I think the movie handles this better. Nagisa also acts less spineless and a lot more on her own there.
>the build up of Tomoya and Nagisa’s relationship through the first run >of CLANNAD felt entirely natural.
In fact I didn’t feel anything build up at all ^^;; And I enjoyed Clannad the most during the episodes when Nagisa was away, because I finally felt like there were some characters with personality, which unfortunately didn’t last long v.v
The whole part about Tomoya chosing Nagisa could have been a lot more touching and interesting … but they prefered to show us Fuko and Kotomi who completely disappeared or became stupid running gags afterwards >____<
I’d like to point out here that since After Story is the real story of Clannad, and since After Story is largely about Nagisa (rather, her absence) then if you hate Nagisa, you pretty much hate Clannad…
I agree with Myssa. Nagisa doesn’t have to be interesting or unique. She’s perfect for Tomoya and that’s what matters.
That being said, I think her story in Clannad TV wasn’t handled that great (especially episode 18, which was terrible) but that’s just me.
Also, for those people actually looking for a tsundere female Key lead, look forward to Little Busters, which looks fantastic anyway. (I swear, I’d give up Haruhi 2 for Little Busters… It looks that good…)
I think this is the part where one’s personal experiences, gender, and biases come into play in the argument. ;)
I was serious about the wish-fulfillment part though; do remember about the target DEMOGRAPHIC of these games (exhibit A, or the socially awkward/inept 2D-musume loving male), and think of the moe stereotypes each of the girls represent, well, it would be hypocritical to say that they DON’T pander to the moe likes or fetishes of said target audience — who more often than not don’t really care much about the story at all. The meek girl, the tsundere, the smart one, the mysterious outsider, the older sister type… Stereotypes you’d usually find in other games or shows of the genre.
So obviously, the game wasn’t made for someone like me in mind. I found the other paths in the original CLANNAD game absolute chores to go through, barring side-characters like Misae or Mei’s. Why? Because I found the personalities of some of the girls, quite frankly, infuriating. Nevermind the strength of the storytelling, the so-called personalities that harem lovers found lovable grated my sensibilities. Tough Girl Tomoyo, not so much, but Kyou/Ryou’s route really took the cake. My God, in high school I’d have tagged Kyou as an insufferable hypocrite, and not only that, but a BACKSTABBING insufferable hypocrite.
Hnngg, high school memories bubbling up… Breathe deeply, breathe deeply…
So yeah, I like Nagisa, meek girl/onee-san/sick girl stereotype aside, and I liked the bland, unexciting, normality of Nagisa’s School Life route.
…
And now, we return to your regularly scheduled Meido.
Before I return to my work making stock traders’ lives a living hell, I’ll second Kaisos. If you did not enjoy CLANNAD so far, did not LIKE Nagisa so far (or her subtle contributions to Tomoya’s change in attitude), good luck, After Story is not going to be enjoyable for you.
Wholeheartedly agree with that. Nagisa is a girl, I would have as a friend, talk to her about whatever problems quench her soul, but never any more.
Myssa Rei and Minikui also have a few good points I agree with, but it would be way to long cite everything.
It was mentioned quite a lot, that Clannad’s theme is “family”. The only time I really got that feeling was when Tomoyo was talking about hers. I probably couldn’t really say why it touched me way more than Nagisa’s whole family issue, but it did.
Hmm let me try to explain why. Call me strange if you want, but Nagisa’s family secret sounded kind of forced to me. Like everything is fine for her and her family (and in a way her parents are happy, even if they can not pursue their “dreams”), only she is not for whatever unknown reasons there is. It feels like, I am not satisfied with my family give me an even better one or maybe my family is better without me …
Uh, hello? I think her family is pretty good in contrast to the nearly none existing one that is Tomoya’s.
Her parents themselves decided what they do with their own live. And they did it because they wanted to, so where is the problem. I just don’t get this whole “I am sorry for being alive and destroyed your dreams” thing. A child does take a lot off of his/her parents thats a fact. But the child also gives a lot back. Somehow I sorely miss that fact presented in her storyline.
As for Nagisa herself, it kind of radiates the vibe of “I did something horrible to my parents so I need to make amends for it”. Amends as in be submissive, never really say what she herself wants to do, cook, clean, do whatever they want and so on (you get the drift). It’s sad that she is that way.
Please don’t call the whole moe things up. I can only speak for myself, but apart of my first comment (which was really just intended as a purely rhetorical question and I was more than surprised to find two people answering to it) the moe aspect did not take part in any way for my comments (Okay, minus the Tomoyo is delicious – you got me there kukuku ;p).
Versus fails at the blockquote cite thing … meh, excuse me for that :/
I’d also like to point out that, despite being straight and male, I hate Kyou with a passion too.
Not that I didn’t like her route, but…
Delicious thigh meat, my shapely arse it is. In real life, Kyou would probably be the first girl I’d have strangled out of sheer annoyance. Set your sister up with a guy you secretly like. Cute. Steal said guy from your sister, after the two have been dating for a while, and going so far as to pretend you’re the said twin sister. Not Cute. Not cute at ALL.
Thanks, I’d take bland and normal over an insincere (to herself and to others), two-faced (tsundere? HAH), and irresolute marshmallow who hides behind a tough front. And otaku find that cute? ~_~
>I’d like to point out here that since After Story is the real story of >Clannad
I agree. That’s why imho it’s stupid to cut it up into two season. But well, seems to be a new fashion -_- Still, I watched the movie and quite enjoyed the after story part, so I think the anime might turn out good as well. Even if, as said, I liked Nagisa a lot more in the movie.
Versus: completely agree about the pseudo-drama of nagisa’s family … you should watch the movie maybe ;) that whole part was a lot more convincing in there (and I dunno which one is closer to the game), but it also spoilers the after story.
I wonder, how does Kyou and Ryou’s route look like? I don’t think they really included it in the anime, did they? In the anime I rather liked Kyou and Ryou, eventhough I usually hate Kyou-type characters. ^^;
ok, Myssa was faster … indeed, that doesn’t sound very nice. thumbs down, Kyou XD
>And otaku find that cute? ~_~
there are so many things otakus find cute and most of it is incomprehensible to me. At least, I can be sure that I’m not an otaku, eventhough I love anime. ^^
tomoyo thigh meat is superior..
really tomoyo is superior in every way
Article in Newsweek about moot. Considering he doesn’t come up with the meme, can he really be considered a king of meme?
>> Okay, im done now. Maybe I am still angry for all those lost posts…
I think my comment spam protection is the most hated thing in the world. I think it even tops hating George W. Bush.
>>.I’d like to point out here that since After Story is the real story of Clannad, and since After Story is largely about Nagisa (rather, her absence) then if you hate Nagisa, you pretty much hate Clannad…
I’d like to point out that you’re full as many holes as Gundam 00.
1. Who says that After Story is the real story of Clannad? Did I miss out on the big press release? Did suddenly Kaisos’ opinion on what he likes constitute the word of Oyashiro-sama? Clannad is the sum of everything Clannad, including After Story, but it doesn’t make After Story more or less important than other parts. You can argue that it’s long, but I can argue that, franchise-wise, Tomoyo’s story is longer just because of Tomoyo After. I can then argue that they actually bothered with a sequel based on Tomoyo whereas… oh wait… there’s no H-scenes of any other haremette.
2. Look at this this way: let’s say I’m a fan of the 76ers, but I can’t stand Elton Brand. So Elton signs with the 76ers. Does it make me hate the 76ers? No.
3. Repeating again, I never said I hated Nagisa or thought she was a bad character. I just thought– because there are better choices– that she was a poor choice as one of the end girls. She would be fantastic for Wind or Final Approach (or even Sekirei as things are looking).
>> I’d also like to point out that, despite being straight and male, I hate Kyou with a passion too. Not that I didn’t like her route, but…
See, you just contradicted yourself. If you like a character, you can surely hate the end product and vice-versa.
>> If you did not enjoy CLANNAD so far, did not LIKE Nagisa so far (or her subtle contributions to Tomoya’s change in attitude), good luck, After Story is not going to be enjoyable for you.
Again, where is this not liking Nagisa bias? Again, I’m pointing out that Nagisa is a poor choice in light of superior options. It’s like “Hey, let’s sign Rashard Lewis to $126 million.” Honestly, I think I bring up sports so much because sports fans mirror anime fans so much. If I complain about Rashard to Magic fans, they’ll say I’m hating on him.
No, I’m not. I think he’s a good player and good for 24 points and 7 boards a game. Just I don’t think he’s worth 40% of your salary cap especially since there’s no way in hell I can imagine him turning into the best player on a championship team. And, to make it worse, the Magic will have to pay Dwight Howard someday, and he does have a chance to be the best player on a championship team. Do you think he’s going to ask for less than $126 million now that Rashard is getting that?
I really think people who don’t follow sports miss out on the parallels between the two cultures of fanboys. It’s a fairly interesting comparison. People tend to lose their minds and logic abilities based on this. My favorite has to be all the lopsided trades fanboys come up with… Joe Dumars is a horrible GM because he won’t trade Rip and a #1 draft pick for Kobe! Seriously. I saw that recently on a Pistons’ forum. How can you argue with someone who probably writes for Sunrise?
>> Wow, the comments has broken into 3 digits, has this ever happened before?
Occasionally. Most recently for Kyonko.
>> What about Slayers? XD And are you still watching Kaiba?
Kaiba’s still a bit too trippy to me. I’m not exactly sure where that series is going anymore. I’ll probably marathon it, but I don’t look forward to it anymore.
I need a few more episodes before I judging Slayers. The problem I have right now is that I barely remember the original. I think I watched it like 10 years ago, so considering I don’t even remember what I had for dinner on Tuesday, this will be a struggle. I almost kinda wish that they just rebooted the series (like what they did with Birdy) to make it more accessible.
(And it does seem dated. Hearing Lina complain about her breasts… I mean… newer anime characters like Shana and Louise are a lot flatter, so I can’t take those complaints seriously anymore. Really, Louise has taken the whole breast jealousy bit to the next level.)
Jason, I think your NBA references are lost on the better part of your readership (here’s where I say “But not me!” (Aren’t NBA references now a little out of season though?)), but I can see your perspective on your attitude towards Nagisa. You don’t necessarily have any objective qualms with this poor girl, but in subjective comparison with other choices, she ranks behind. Thusly, her sudden and lofty ascent to the top, through no ability or quality of her own, defies most logical and intuitive tenants of sound decision making (from your perspective). You just get all fussy when people say “You hate Nagisa”, but you want them to see “You hate the Nagisa choice.” Admittedly, those two phrases are not easily distinguishable without understanding your perspective.
Look at me, talking about some anime like I actually know something about it! Is Derailed by Darry turning me into Skip Bayless?!
Do take note that I’m taking the argument more or less light-heartedly, but the perceived like or dislike of a character, in the end, boils down to the personal bias of the viewer.
Jason think’s Nagisa’s sub-par, compared to all the other characters; I don’t hold it against him. Just as I hope he doesn’t mind it when I say that, aside from possibly Misae, Mei, and Nagisa, I found all the other females in CLANNAD (the game) annoying. Why? Because they possessed character traits that I don’t like, or at the very least would have annoyed me if displayed in a real person.
Oh, right. I HAVE encountered girls like that back in high school. *slaps forehead*
To be fair, again, I think that KyoAni is also partly at fault here. By trying to please EVERYONE, the result is the adaptation seemed aimless compared to, say, AIR. The game mostly avoids this, as each path is mostly independent of the other, with very little interation between the girls than what is minimally needed, but in many ways causes the problem as well.
Actually Jason, Tomoyo After is only as long as After Story. Take away all the H-scenes (the lack of which made fanboys cry foul, which is sad, since a story should stand on its own without throwing in sex), it’s about the same length, since it more or less only shows Tomoyo’s last year in High School. I’d think it could have been sneaked into the original release of CLANNAD, had the idea occured to Jun Maeda at the time.
But again, it’s probably just me. I mean, they’re making an ADULT ONLY remake of Little Busters after all. Fanboys are fearsome.
>> Why? Because they possessed character traits that I don’t like, or at the very least would have annoyed me if displayed in a real person.
You bring up an interesting point. For me, it’s all about entertainment value. I don’t think of the characters as my new BFF or whatever. I just think of what gives the most entertainment value (hence why I watch CG R2). I might even lean towards characters that I won’t bother with in real life. For example, I love Mirai Nikki. Would I ever date a girl who drugs me and drags around her parent’s skulls with her? Probably not.
>> Actually Jason, Tomoyo After is only as long as After Story.
Well CS and PS2 versions are a lot longer than the H version of Tomoyo After. So, uh, counterpoint!
>> To be fair, again, I think that KyoAni is also partly at fault here. By trying to please EVERYONE, the result is the adaptation seemed aimless compared to, say, AIR.
They can please more people; they just needed more episodes to do so. Like I don’t think Clannad anime was bad. I really enjoyed it. But it just had a lot of material to go through, and they shouldn’t have spent 1/4th of the show on wooden starfish. That was a bad choice. It would be like Peter Jackson taking 2 hours to go through the initial Hobbit festival.
>> Is Derailed by Darry turning me into Skip Bayless?!
If you know who Skip Bayless is, then you probably understand 75% of my sports references. So you have no excuse.
Hnng, getting too serious…
I think it’s fairly obvious that I like ‘normal’ characters (well, more normal than the circumstances they’re in anyway), so I apologize for the relatively heated tone of my posts. I just find it hard to keep quiet whenever people pick on the ‘normal’ one (whether it was their actual intent or just a trick of perception) just because they’re not, oh, cuter in some strange way that only fanboys understand.
Anyway, carry on. I’ll have to bow out of this one.
I saw this originally at Fanime… finally made it on YouTube. (Thanks Dustin)
*watches video with bemusement*
So… this is about Itsuki being Kyon’s girlfriend? Or that’s how I’d interpret the video… yup. Jason’s gone past the melonpan and DFC stage, straight to the BL. In that case, Antique Bakery is NOT for you – there’s not as much yaoi in there as there is in Code Geass. Nor as much man-on-man flirting and groping (damn you, Rolo).
Well, there is a reason why I usually pass on browsing the KyonxItsuki thread in Sos-dan.org… And it’s not because of BL hate (clue: because my KyonxHaruhi folder needs more love).
And bravo for derailing things before the argument became too heated for EVERYONE.
In terms of your delusional fantasies, Haess, that one takes the cake. Why does everything gets interpreted back to me? Unless you have an unnatural fixation with me… then again, you send me plenty of Mako-cakes images and flood this post with Hosaka…
OH GEASS NO!
You want to be Itsuki, and you want me to be Kyon! My gosh, I’m going to get a restraining order on you.
I just found out that all the Sekirei were male before and they transmutated ……….. sorry, I just had to post that.
Now see, if that was redone genderbent it would please a larger group of people. Right now it is just funny. With Kyonko and Itsuko, it would be funny and possibly hot.
Jason: I had no clue that video existed until you linked it. Of COURSE you’re the one to blame, both for viewing it the first time, then linking it again now that we’re arguing about Clannad and payscales.
Besides, I flooded you with more Haruka than Mako-cakes, as my Sent Items folder keeps insisting. You just fixated on the Mako-cakes shots… and ignored Haruka in a swimsuit. Damn you.
This video is kind of disturbing …
I am looking forward to play the actual Clannad game, as it sounds it will provide much of an insight for me.
Thanks for fixing my failed cite, btw.
As long as we’re linking videos, anyone see this yet?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9K4RKM_hzzI
Amazing role reversal, delusional fantasies… can’t say I’m not on topic, right?
Haess, I can’t believe you just used the “You asked for it!” defense. Sigh. I’m going to ask the judge for 100m, no less.
BTW, I really enjoyed this post. It was a lot of fun and reminded me a bit of why I still do this. While a lot of the discussion here is silly, it’s still, by far, some of the most intelligent anime discussions that I’ve seen lately. Just to not spoil the moment, I pushed back the post I had for midnight to tomorrow.
Anyway, enjoy some Kamina.
What part of ‘I sent you more Haruka-neesama pics than Mako-chan pics, but you keep bringing up the Mako-chan’ counts as the “Asked for it” defense? Besides, you DID link to that thing, and apparently looked for that Itsuki video. I was living in blissful ignorance of its existence until now.
But going back on-topic, does Nagisa really count as normal? Or more as needy? I’ve seen arguments on both sides of the fence, but given how she was portrayed by KyoAni, she seems more needy than normal. Which is a moe-mode that I really dislike, but seems to hit the spot for a lot of otaku who feel a need to have women dependent on them emotionally.
Wha-what?!
Talk about one-ups-manship! Jason’s on some kind of roll here!
*twitch*
“‘I sent you more Haruka-neesama pics than Mako-chan pics, but you keep bringing up the Mako-chan’”
the fact that you actually sent mako-cakes pics worries me… wait… then who do i blame my brokeness then? Jason may have post the pic, but you are the supplier/pimp… damn you!!
Work for the day, DONE.
But what about me Haess? I KNOW that I’m a perfectly hetero, healthy, and relatively stable woman, but I like Nagisa, though I never saw her as the type that needed to be coddled and babied (in other words, the emotionally depentent), but I do admit to her being a hybrid of the onee-san/meek girl/sick girl modes of moe. Does that make me… Broken for Nagisa?
I’ll say I like Nagisa. While I might like the idea of Tomoyo or Kyou in the bderoom better than Nagisa, I feel that her relationship with Tomoya was the most natural, and in the end would be suited for a long happy marriage. Besides, how often do you find a mother-in-law that you really like and likes you, and also a fairly cool father-in-law? Especially if you come from a broken family life. While I like Nagisa, I love the idea of having her family as part of my own. Selling point for a relationship can also be good family. her mother is intelligent (but still a bit of a goofy MILF) and her father rocks compared to Tomoya’s.
However we don’t ever see Kyou and Ryou’s family do we. I suspect Shion or Mion were involved.
Ithekro: Ha ha, well, it really depends whether or not Mion and Keiichi actually get it on… In the PS2 remake of Higurashi, we see that Keiichi had plans on going back to Tokyo to continue his studies, and that Mion ALSO wanted to follow him there. Heck, the whole point of the little ‘date’ they had in Okonomiya’s library after all was helping Mion study so she could pass the entrance exam of whatever school Keiichi wanted to attend.
While it doesn’t look like much of a problem, do take into account that a) Mion is the Sonozaki heir, which practically requires her to stay in the Hinamizawa area, and b) there’s the Hinamizawa syndrome to think about as well. So, barring a major miracle (something on the level of what Bernkastel or Lambda-Delta is capable of doing), it’s kind of hard for things to work out well.
Still, that’s a thought.
Hmm, come to think of it, I don’t think Kyou or Ryou’s family was mentioned at all in their route. Off-hand, I can only remember the following from the game:
Tomoya: Father, Grandmother (After Story)
Nagisa: Mother, Father
Fuuko: Sister
Kotomi: Mother, Father (both through flashback)
Tomoyo: Brother, Father, Mother, Half-sister (Tomoyo After)
Mei: Brother (duh)
>>Who says that After Story is the real story of Clannad? Did I miss out on the big press release? Did suddenly Kaisos’ opinion on what he likes constitute the word of Oyashiro-sama?
Actually, it really is. It’s not just my opinion, the story in AS is the entire point of Clannad. The show, as said, doesn’t make this obvious at all, but…
The fact that you think Nagisa is a shitty end girl doesn’t preclude the fact that she is the end girl, and nothing can really change that…
And I wasn’t really adressing you as a “Nagisa-hater” anyway.
In addition, they are plenty of moments in AS that could have resulted in a Nagisa H-scene. Blame the All-Ages rating, not the girl.
Lastly, do you know how Tomoyo After ends? Because it is far less positive and happy than the Nagisa end…
Wow, this post just broke 150. It’s a new record!
In any case, does anyone know when the clannad OVA is coming out?
EvilDevil: Jason introduced us to Mako-cakes. I merely sent the meido shot and then the pool eps of Okawari with the glorious Hosaka delusion and sleeping Haruka pan shots. Oh, and drunk Hayami causing an emo facial distortion on Kana with drunk Haruka.
Myssa Rei: no, you’re just broken. I’m surprised that Tomoyo in half a maid uniform set you off, though.
Kaisos: I thought the whole point of Tomoyo After was Nagisa died and he became an alcoholic, he got a Mulligan for his life, picked Tomoyo, and died anyways… which is why I said he’d had the worst luck of Key’s protagonists outside of the Junker’s.
And Jason said you only had to spell the word “spoiler” in the tag too. Heh.
Completely off-topic, but I was wondering when Jason actually started using the term “broken”.
And I don’t want to know what you watch on youtube, especially since you managed to come up with that video.
Inserting my two-cents a little late on the whole Nagisa thing…I think that although she isn’t my favorite end girl I understand why she would be picked for the sake of storytelling. They needed “sickly girl” who kicks the bucket plot device to make Tomoya end up like his father. If he goes with one of the other girls, it would require something more resembling deus ex machina. For instance he picks Kyou, and they get married, have kids, Tomoya gets his blue-collar job, etc. But she doesn’t DIE. So from a storytelling standpoint its a good pick, however she isn’t my favorite.
Haesslich: Actually, I think I’ve mentioned repeatedly that Tomoyo After is a parallel storyline. Take into consideration this fact: Nagisa dies around 2 years after both she and Tomoya have graduated (she graduates one year later than everyone else), and have more or less shacked up together. Tomoyo After happens during her last year of High School… Which is one year after the end of the School Life phase of CLANNAD.
Well it’s not merely an Adult Only remake. They’re increasing the total number of CGs for all story lines, the bath scene CG simply has the towels removed, but they’ve also rewritten parts of the original cast’s story lines, adding more depth to many of the characters fans felt had weaker stories (IE everyone but Rin), as well as introducing the 3 new characters to the scene, the Tsundere of which has an entirely tangential story line, while the other two are essentially moved up from unattainable minor character to capturable heroine status. They’re also altering much of the soundtrack, for example the new Opening theme is the Rockstar Remix of the original. Admittedly some felt this decision was planned for due to the Clannad/Tomoyo After fiasco, considering how soon the announcement was made after the original’s release but that doesn’t make the Extasy(sic) version and less worthwhile of a purchase.
Not that I’m trying to defend a pre-order I’m picking up in 12 days or anything…
Actually, If you ask me, it’s about Itsuki being Jealous of Kyon Dating Haruhi, and thus enacting an elaborate ploy to steal Kyon away from her. I base this judgment on lines such as the chours: “I don’t like your girlfriend, I think you need a new one”, “Make your girlfriend dissapear, I don’t wanna hear you ever say her name again.”
So as such, The video is clearly Jason’s secret confession that he has, rather than gone past, decisively forsaken and pushed away all that is right and full of melonpan such as our goddess, and shall hereafter engage in an open pursuit of boy’s love and yaoi. Previous Kyonko posts and the pictures at the end of Code Geass posts were merely the warning signs that this was to come. I would not be surprised if we find this blog filled with Naked men in the near future. I think the Luluko post up now further reaffirms my conclusion as to the direction this blog is taking.
So I must agree, Jason should indeed keep watching Geass, but I think he might enjoy Antique Bakery as well, if only to watch the Devlish Gay in action.
So, In honor of Jason’s new decleration, have a present.
Now I’m gonna go play some Seinarukana.
…I wonder If I’m broken, not, or somewhere far far beyond that term of measure.
Er, that was the intended present.Though You might prefer this oneinstead.
Tomoyo is win is seems. We’ll see what is in store for us in her OVA soon.